Neck pain induced by the biological clock

[Piergino Pedrocco]

Hi. I am 63.
I could be the only person in the world with a neurological symptom strictly related to the biological clock.
My situation is quite good and I don’t think it is necessary to do invasive tests or to take drugs for now. It’s like there was a timer telling my symptoms to start, and then, in the morning, more gradually, to disappear.
It is a mild but disabling pain in the back muscles of the neck. It works in a time slot, and it seems a stimulus-sensitive disease. As symptoms begin, I have to stop reading, and then stop standing, and I have to lie down in bed in a quiet room all night. All this, in order to avoid worsening the symptoms in the muscles of my neck. The use of neurons to counteract gravity when I am standing, the use of neurons to read or look at small details, and the use of neurons to analyze noise cause pain in the neck, maybe a contraction of some muscles of my neck, which after persists, and, if I try to force, this makes me feel worse. However, these chronic symptoms had almost gone with biofeedback. Now they came back, probably due to an overly stressful workload. I am healthy from about seven in the morning until about 7:17 in the afternoon, but only if I lie down by 8:30 in the evening and if I don’t get up until about 7:00 the next day (solar time). Anticipating or postponing the time when I lie down by a minute can make me earn or lose an hour of activity in the morning.
Anyway, I heard over 20 specialists in my life. Two had written cervical dystonia. Other neurologists have denied that it was cervical dystonia. A fairly authoritative doctor wrote that my cephalotension disorder could have been caused by using sulpiride to treat anxiety when I was young. A few other movement disorders neurologists prefer do not care about my case.
So, my disability is only at night. In the last two years, noises only have bothered me when I have to lie down at night. I could read without a clock and tell you when it’s about 7:17 p.m. (solar time), which is when I, every day, am compelled to turn off my computer and stop reading.
Thank you for your attention.
Best regards.

Piergino P.

[agate]

Welcome, Piergino Pedrocco!

I am just someone who has multiple sclerosis and I don't know much about other disorders but you deserve a reply. I'm just sorry I can't be more helpful.

It sounds as if you have consulted a number of specialists and have had no helpful answers. People here at BrainTalk don't have medical training but we have had some experience with coping with a variety of neurological disorders.

All I can say is that if I were in your situation, I'd try out a variety of possible ways of coping and see if any of them help. I wouldn't be so concerned about what the medical name of my condition is. I'd be more interested in getting the symptoms to stop.

With that in mind, I'd look at every medicine and supplement I've been taking and try to find out if any of them could be responsible for my problem.

Then I'd try altering my sleeping pattern to see if that made any difference.

I'd pay special attention to the activities I routinely do during the day. Some activities, like bending forward to see a computer screen or a cellphone, can put a lot of strain on the neck muscles. Maybe modifying some of these activities would help.

I did not understand this part of your post, however:

The use of neurons to counteract gravity when I am standing, the use of neurons to read or look at small details, and the use of neurons to analyze noise cause pain in the neck, maybe a contraction of some muscles of my neck, which after persists, and, if I try to force, this makes me feel worse. However, these chronic symptoms had almost gone with biofeedback.

You may have tried all of these suggestions. I'm afraid you might have to do what so many people with neurological disorders end up doing--keep on looking for a doctor who will have the knowledge to address your situation.

[Piergino Pedrocco]

Dear Agate,

thank you for your answer and for your advice.
As for the unclear part, I'll try to explain myself with other words.

If I listen to someone talking in the next room, probably some neurons that recognize human voices will activate and try to understand the words.
If this happens before 8:30 P.M. (solar time), this
doesn't create the annoying contraction. If this happens after I have had to lie down, this creates an annoying and persistent contraction.
Equally, to read or decipher small details while keeping my attention on them, I have to use some neurons.
I can only do this in a large daily time slot.
The time slot has not been always the same. It changed a bit over time.

We know that a stimulus-sensitive myoclonus exists. Why should not there be a stimulus-sensitive dystonia?
Or a stimulus-sensitive spasticity (since it is involved the antigravity function of the neck). By analogy with sight and hearing,
I assume that even staying up is a problem of neurons, which only after a certain hour can not be used without creating a worsening in the neck.
And how is it possible that the biological clock says with precision to the symptom to start?
There may be a few minutes difference, but often it starts at the same minute as the previous day.
.
Two particulars, for curious neurologists, are also that I can't try to read with little light (even during the day because I would risk contracting a bit the neck).
Furthermore, I have nocturnal myoclonus.

Sincerely,
Piergino

[agate]

Maybe I'm still misunderstanding but I do think you've gone down an unproductive path when you talk about neurons in this connection. You describe your problem this way:

t is a mild but disabling pain in the back muscles of the neck. It works in a time slot, and it seems a stimulus-sensitive disease. As symptoms begin, I have to stop reading, and then stop standing, and I have to lie down in bed in a quiet room all night. All this, in order to avoid worsening the symptoms in the muscles of my neck.

Doesn't it stand to reason that as the position of your body changes, its pains are often going to change? Gravity pulls on us one way when we're upright, and quite another way when we're horizontal. Different muscles are involved.

For years I've noticed how huge a relief it usually is to me to lie down after I've been upright for several hours, even if being upright means only sitting all the time in a chair. Pains and stiffness often get better, particularly if I drop off to sleep for even a few minutes. This varies with the pain and stiffness, and some pains or tingling sensations or electric shock sensations just don't go away no matter what position I'm in, but quite often a change of position can work wonders.

If that is the way things are for you, I hope you have mentioned that to the doctors you've consulted. They would want to know what helps your pain to go away. They also need to know when the pain is at its worst and whether it changes in quality, and what kind of pain it is (throbbing, piercing, a dull ache, etc.).

[Virginia]

Hi Pergino, I have no answers but I wanted to welcome you to the forum. I have multiple sclerosis and I use to hurt in the back of my neck very bad. Mine was stress related as I set in front of a computer while I was working or bent over at my desk. Once it started it didn't stop until I had gone to bed and slept for quite awhile. Sometime I would get up with it hurting and it would feel stiff. Mine did not show up on scans, but when a Doctor finally did an MRI it turned out I had an MS leison in the back of my neck. Unlike you, mine did not have a certain time to start or stop.

It sounds as though you have sought several opinions and you say you are otherwise healthy. Even if you are healthy it sounds as though your life is somewhat being interrupted due to this pain. I wonder if you have had an MRI? They often show things a scan does not. I hope you find an answer and are able to get help for this

[Piergino Pedrocco]

Dear Agate
I apologize for being late.
All I can say is that it’s a dull, contractional pain.
There are no peaks.
But I have to avoid straining to not feel worse.
The best way to explain my sensation would be to lend it to the specialist (how much I would like it sometimes!).
I can’t explain it with similar sensations in other parts of the body.
Let me explain:
After about 20 and 17 (but today it will probably be a few minutes before, because I didn’t have a good night, especially for some noises; I have to put on earmuffs before I hear the neighbors talking; then, when everyone is asleep, I can take them off, but I have to be ready to put it back on when needed. I am informing myself to insulate the wall) I can’t force myself trying to continue reading. I can look at big numbers, and some big subtitle words, but I can’t type a word in the search engine; I have to wait until 6:30 in the morning. In this sense, there is no maximum of pain, because I must avoid straining.
So, at night, I could get up briefly, but if the next day I want to get up at 7:30 and not have a sore neck when I read, I have to avoid it. But when I’m lying down, there are times I prefer not to even imagine getting up. It’s as if the very thought of getting up activated a bit the neurons that you need in your neck to stand.

Yours sincerely

[Piergino Pedrocco]

Dear Virginia.

Thank you for your welcome and your advice.
I did an MRI many years ago, which showed
a very small cervical hernia C6-C7.
But two neurosurgeons said it wasn’t the cause.

Best regards.

Piergino

[agate]

Dear Agate
I apologize for being late.
All I can say is that it’s a dull, contractional pain.
There are no peaks.
But I have to avoid straining to not feel worse.
The best way to explain my sensation would be to lend it to the specialist (how much I would like it sometimes!).
I can’t explain it with similar sensations in other parts of the body.
Let me explain:
After about 20 and 17 (but today it will probably be a few minutes before, because I didn’t have a good night, especially for some noises; I have to put on earmuffs before I hear the neighbors talking; then, when everyone is asleep, I can take them off, but I have to be ready to put it back on when needed. I am informing myself to insulate the wall) I can’t force myself trying to continue reading. I can look at big numbers, and some big subtitle words, but I can’t type a word in the search engine; I have to wait until 6:30 in the morning. In this sense, there is no maximum of pain, because I must avoid straining.
So, at night, I could get up briefly, but if the next day I want to get up at 7:30 and not have a sore neck when I read, I have to avoid it. But when I’m lying down, there are times I prefer not to even imagine getting up. It’s as if the very thought of getting up activated a bit the neurons that you need in your neck to stand.

Yours sincerely

Some parts of your post aren't clear to me but it sounds as if you have to go to considerable effort just to avoid being disturbed by noisy neighbors. You're wearing earmuffs? Those are usually large enough to be uncomfortable while sleeping. I wouldn't be able to sleep at all in any earmuffs I have known. But maybe you mean earplugs or earbuds, which are smaller and fit directly into the ear?

Maybe there are other ways of cutting down on the neighbor noise. If you haven't tried this, sometimes having more furniture and heavier curtains and rugs will do a lot to buffer noise. Sometimes just moving the bed to another location will help. You might even consider contacting the neighbors if they are being unreasonably loud or making noise late at night--your building might have rules about noise at night. This is a risky procedure if you don't know these neighbors but you might want to think about it.

I mention all of this as a way of enabling you to do without the earmuffs, which might be contributing to your symptoms. I've heard that hanging a quilt on a wall can serve as insulation.

I have quite a few fairly large pictures and every time I've moved, I've noticed a distinct difference in the way sound travels before the pictures are hung on the walls and afterwards. Just a few pictures on the walls can reduce sounds from the outside.

[Piergino Pedrocco]

Dear Agate,

thank you.

I wear earmuffs.
But only the first two hours.
Neighbors are quiet, but the walls are too thin.
Insulating 2 or 3 walls should not cost too much, and the old house would acquire more value.

Best regards.

Piergino

[agate]

Insulation would definitely be the way to go though it's probably a costly and maybe somewhat disruptive project. Well worth it though if the walls are thin.

Hope you have some expertise on the types of insulation and so forth or can find someone who can give you good advice.

[Piergino Pedrocco]

Dear Agate,

thank you again.

In addition to plasterboard walls, and related devices, perhaps there are other competitive technologies.
I’ll ask around for prices per square meter.

Best regards.

Piergino

[agate]

Wish I could be of more help but I have only personal experience to go on when it comes to the acoustics in a room. In some rooms the acoustics are "funny"--not quite right, almost as if there is too much buffering going on. I'm not sure how that happened but I don't think I'd like to spend a lot of time in a room where the soundproofing had been overdone or done wrong. If you can take some time getting the information you need, you should be able to come up with a solution. Being deprived of needed sleep because of noise elsewhere is miserable.

[Piergino Pedrocco]

Dear Agate.

I thank you again.
The problem is precisely to have the time to acquire the information.
But fortunately, I sleep quite well.

Best regards.

PP

[agate]

Do you know about this guy? This looks like information that is laid out fairly clearly.

Only registered and activated users can see links., Click Here To Register...

Curtains are mentioned if you click on the link. That reminds me that I've heard of people hanging ordinary quilts over their windows and on their walls as an inexpensive and easy way to do some soundproofing. I suspect it works too. Just blankets might do but quilts are probably better.

[Piergino Pedrocco]

Dear Agate.

I apologize for being late.
Thank you for your advice.
I have to check which other options there are.
Mass-loaded vinyl could work, but maybe there are other good options.
Many thanks.
Bye for now.